Marx 60mm Arabs in Reissue
As our very good friend Mark McNamara posted in our site two listings of Marx 60mm Arabs were place up for auction on Ebay. Each auction has ten 60mm Marx Arabs. Each auction has six of the hard plastic accessories from Arab tent that was also in the Marx Ben Hur playset. Finally there is there is the Marx camel one auction has one camel the other has two. The Arabs are the same in each auction difference being one set is in brown the other set is in white. The accessories are in two different colors red and white. The most amazing part is the dealer states the Marx 60mm Arabs are recasts or reissues.
The question is Marx 60mm Arabs is an original Marx mold or was the figures copied? Looking at the photo the figures look to be the correct height. The figure configuration on the Mexico Mold is wrong it has two standing firing rifle where the American mold only one standing firing.
PL742 Marx Arab Mold set up
Arab standing firing one
Arab advancing rifle across waist two
Arab with knife two
Mounted Arab with rifle one
Mounted Arab with Scimitar one
Arab with Scimitar two
Arab kneeling with rifle one
Mexico Arab Mold Set up
Arab standing firing two
Arab advancing rifle across waist two
Arab with knife one
Mounted Arab with rifle one
Mounted Arab with Scimitar one
Arab with Scimitar two
Arab kneeling with rifle one
Marx 60mm Arabs in Reissue Final Thoughts
What makes this more interesting is the Marx Mexican mold was in Hong Kong with Rado. We know the Marx Arabs were done in Warriors of the World style. These figures were thought for a time to be salesmen samples. Mark Hegemon sent us a photo back of Warriors of the World box. Listed on the back of the box was the Marx Arabs.
Mark also sent us a photo of the Marx Arabs done in Hong Kong. As you can see they did all the foot poses.
So the question is the Marx 60mm Arabs in Reissue from original Marx mold or not. We will be working on problem and let you know.
Wile the MARX set FFL is nice and plenty poses, but it lack a lot action poses, only two are shooting, the running had rifle in not charging position and arms as was giving a hug; 11 poses total 2 standing, one marching, two officer plus 2 characters and one mounted in action with saber overhead. The One officer is pointing and other with gun ,not shooting.
ARABS
Now I had always wonder in the mystery of production .
Marx Arab set had the not usual set of 7 poses count as they most time did 6 to 8 poses in the 60mm and 6″ or even poses numbers in the 54 mm most.
The Arabs have 6 in the 60 mm (more accurate 63/64 mm) wile the advancing with rifle across is 54 mm with smaller head and body mass proportion and rifle/face more detail typical of 54 mm scale poses.
The an odd 3er mounted pose appear much later(been recast around for years now) in 54 mm also was along recast and definitely base in same exact pose as 60 mm mounted but with minor difference, I had got several of this to change poses but hard to do as cast in recast hard plastic x odd reason. No apparent confirmed proved source of where this single pose mold come from or who owned and run I have red.
I’m wondering if this last pose (3er mounted pose) together with the running 54 mm on foot was intended x a never done 54 mm scale Arabs because as I far I know not other 60 mm scale Marx set had an small scale pose mix with it. And MARX decided to not do a 54 mm and launch just the 7 poses including one in small scale.
Also please notice the entire dress and head style of the small pose to all other (with same head turban type) and will see the difference.
The small POSE carry a typical south Arabian style turban as that used by Laurence of Arabia officer and Arabs with him ,wile other 6 poses have the northern Africa style turban, definitely two arts ,two artist were involved in my opinion.
Also-Wile observing the bases on all foot poses ,the small figure top surface base is different texture and shape around ,the bottom holes mold entries are located in different position and smaller. So it was from a separated mold intercalated with others x playset/else and make in to 1 mold of odd not usual 7 poses?.
Also like to add that the two camels poses are in not scale with 60 mm poses mounted at all and next to horses almost same high wile if you mount the 54 mm recast pose base in 60 mm pose ,it will look much better and actually fit better tide.
Just my thoughts and observation that give me some doubts and wonders..
Erwin, I do not doubt your observation. I’ve had these, but I am not interested in them and always sold them off. Since I am not familiar with the FFL show, I’m wondering if there was a particular villain? Maybe the 54 mm pose was intended as a character figure but never recognized as such? Another character on the show perhaps?
Are his facial features Arab or Caucasian, such as Laurence of Arabia?
Interesting.
Bill.
I never saw the show neither till much later and not like that much as too comic, not particular villain ,most arabs bad villain where as always in black long robe ,not as this figure. The FFL had their captain gallant and other character-boy. Marx did two officer probably representing other two film characters
If an Arab villain would had been done as character would be the seated pose I guess.
You need to see figures to realize the big discrepancy in size and body proportion.
About faces I thought you were joking, I hope so!!
They are indeed American actor faces in he Arabs as most movie had back them, so Italian, Greek , German,Dutch,English, French ,Slavic, Spaniards, Irish ,Jews from all over world, Chinese ,Latinos(no Anthony Quing) this time and so on .
As far I know and saw Caucasian is not what is made many of Hollywood actors .TV series used less common actors and cheap extras, many Mexicans as filmed in south of the border because dessert scenes in this series case.
Marx generally used two faces only and add gesture or beard/mustaches to most 60 mm figures ,you see it with well or if want with a magnifier better.
I like the figures because very well done and I collect all eras. About FFL movies I like the two version March and Died and Beau Geste most.
Best…
Erwin – A surprisingly good FFL movie was done only for VHS, never in the movies, called ‘Legionaire’ starring Jean Claude Van Dam. It’s a typical FFL kind of story and enjoyable.
Greg.yes I got it.but I do not like the plot not the end.Sorry .
I aaw once in 90s whwn come out.
The action is partially well done,rest is not in my opinion
Greg, sorry x typing in rush on phone.
thanks..
I mean I saw the movie and in my personal opinion I did not like the plot, neither the end .It is a mix of two movies plot (Beau Geste) and “march and died” with a very peace message and pro revolutionary view at the end.
Portraying AK as a merciful, he was not ,extensive record/proof show he tortured prisoners a lot .
In my opinion not good, the action was correct as well depiction of both sides clothing, weapon armies.
It was released in cable in 98,after in VHS to commercialize.
I like JCV simple acting in his movies.
Any how I’m glad u like it and enjoy. Too few had been done about this elite military special force. There few others, two France, one good one bad too, plus two made in Spain. I forgot name now. Will get then later
Best
The show was set in modern day. The figures in the playset other than Cuffy and Captain Gallant were modern day while the other Foreign Legion are 19th century. an article written many years ago felt the character figures were add on to existing idea.
To me, a “recast” means a figure which has been cast from an original mold, but the mold is now owned by someone other than the original corporate owner.
These 60mm Marx Arabs are now being advertised on ebay as “recasts”. They look identical to the originals, except for color and type of plastic, right down to the facial expressions.
My question (if anyone knows the answer) is whether this means the Marx 60mm Arab molds have now been located?
For all these years, right through the heyday of Marx recasts, we’ve been assured that no one could locate the Captain Gallant molds.
Now, all of a sudden, they appear. Where these “recast” recently? Or were they “recast” a long time ago, but since then the molds have been lost or destroyed? Are there thousands of these recasts now available, or just these two advertised sets?
What’s up? Admin? Kent Sprecher? CTS? Murphy? MarxMan?
Don
I created the word reissue to define a figure being produced by another company other than the original owner. the term recast means the same which I believe was used by Bill Murphy.
As I mention the mold was in Hong Kong. This could be a second mold that was made for some reason. As why it turned up now is anyone’s guess. It is a murky question that we hope to get answers in the future.
So far as I understand it, that is the definition of a recast. I had never done FFL, but if both sides come available in recast. I might buy myself a nice pile, buy or make a fort and get into it.
3D printed ? Also Captain Gallant is available on Blue Ray or DVD I don’t remember which I have some epesodes myself ,it is also on I believe Hulu , the show reminded me a lot like Rin Tin Tin with the cavalry, the show was better than I expected and now I love the old Rin Tin Tin and Captain Gallant both which I never saw until years later in reruns !
I’m currently the high bidder on the brown Arab set. Of course, with 2 days and 9 hours left in the auction, this means absolutely nothing.
But I simultaneously sent in a few questions to the ebay lister (Galaxy—-). We’ll see if he provides any answers.
Back when I was just getting into the toy soldier as an adult, I was quite enthralled with all the great recasts which were available. The price of original Marx at that time had gotton so high there was no way I could afford to acquire the massed armies I wanted to set up. I viewed recasts as a godsend. I used to pray that somehow the Marx Captain Gallant figures would also come out as recasts, but of course they never did.
I remember seeing an ad in PFPC in which the Marx Arab standing shooter was listed for $52.00, as were the two mounted poses and the kneeling pose with rifle. The remaining three poses (the mold double shots) were each listed at $40.00 each. I can’t remember who the advertiser was, but it was one of the big dealers that had one of those typed full-page ads with column after column of listings of original Marx plastic by the figure — the kind of ad we seldom see anymore.
Don I do not know but I have plenty ,least 4 each pose and few converted Arabs original and I had never paid more 15-18 per figure ,last I got was barely a year ago -3 of them .All in ebay,none in show where they ask no less than 35/40 a piece.Stad had sold some in very good condition x that price and I had get then fast. FLare actually more abundant to get cheap.
So to me these reissues or recast at $40.00 plus counting sound a bit high.I do not know how many are willing paint over $45.00 x a new set in not accurate plastic.
And I hope if ever come available in quantities x the sake of hobby some retailers do not go off their head and put them at Plubius prices or more
What then do we call a figure that is made from a mold the owner created, but it is of an original figure or figures? Just curious.
Mark .3D do not live exes halve residue as mold cast figure would..Those has it,so are from a mold.
Hand or machine pressed.
Ed ,you mean original cast figures.
Someone has an original figure or figures, they make a mold from that figure or figures and produce them. Since they are not made from the original mold they are not truly re-casts per the definition above, so what would we call them?
I work as a business analyst and one of my duties is communicating between the user world and the programming world. In the user world a word like application means the customer is filling out a form to apply for insurance. In the programming world an application is a program. So, for the sake of these lively discussions I just want to be on the same page as everyone else. It avoids confusion later on.
A good example of what Ed is talking about is the “Falling horse and rider” recast. The original mold is missing – the ‘repros’ are not made from the original molds, but rather a copy. To me, it makes more sense to call that a “re-cast” rather than a re-issue from the original mold. …or perhaps “reproduction.”
A good example of what
Only MY opinion:
I work in psychology and psychiatry where we use “operational definitions” (daffynitions ?) which seek to explain meanings in common, simple, concrete terms; so from my world:
“Recast” toys are made from original molds by someone other than the original manufacturer. So, an original Marx toy was made by Louis Marx & Co. in the ’50s & ’60s before Quaker Oats, etc..
If, e.g., Hobbybunker makes duplicates with the old original mold with modern plastic, those are recasts.
“Copies” are replicas of originals with new molds or modified molds by different manufacturers. (I think??????)….. 🙂
In my old age, I find I’m more willing to “settle” for recasts for $20 vs. originals for $200 & make believe they are “real”. I sold a complete set (YES, including the little dog) of original 60mm Marx Ranch Kids in 4/2006 for $2000. I now have two sets of multicolored recast from Mexico that I like BETTER than the plain cream colored $2000 originals. The second set cost me $24.99 this year. I forgot what I paid for the first set that I had before the originals.
I will use the word reissue as that is what I have been using for the last 25 plus years. I never liked the word recast. If you want to use recast be my guest.
I agree Andy,Made from a new mold of a original figure not original molds a “copy” is a good term for that ! Today it is possible also to make a “copy” from 3d printer also.
A mold made from an original figure which is not yours would be considered ‘a copy’ and if the detail didn’t hold up ‘a bad copy’ 🙂
This has been an ongoing discussion for years and I don’t expect everyone will ever agree.
If you consider a re-issue being a figure made from the original mold by another company, as Admin states, what do you call a re-issue of an original figure in a different colour by the original manufacturer, which Marx did all the time in its’ Playsets. Could this not be considered a re-issue too as it is a colour variation on the original intended colour.
Even Britains have re-issued figures in different colour schemes than originally intended.
Maybe recast is a better term for figures made from an original mold by another company.
Les technically I agree with you 100%%. Yes you are correct reissue had always been any issue do “after” first issue using same mold by the company who run then first.”it could be same company or other and could be 6 month after firs issue or 10 years.
Recast x me is do base (Britannic dictionary of word cast) the repetition-=making new mold and producing figures from that new mold base in same exact figure /pose,some times call too cloned figure or cloned mold. It should not varied in any at all-but finish paint of figure if like.
Any how the use is often mix and match .but as per use of English correct words ,it take a simple observation to come to your right conclusion.
For me I call then most time as that.
Now if mold is done with different variation poses base in original I think that is another tale ,either popular call piracy or mold/figures poses variation copies or wherever…SAMPLE-DSD -Argentina variation Britain detail sets produced by them that copied the mold(casting a slight variation poses new figure derivate of original mold/pose)
I’ll accept that re-cast and copies works for me. Re-issues works for me too, I guess in the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter much except maybe to me.
I wouldn’t mind re-casts so much if it wasn’t for the crappy plastic they use most of the time. Many re-casts are brittle or hard plastic sometimes both. I do buy them, but mainly for conversions purposes
I’ve always used the words “recast” and “reissue” interchangeably, but one idea was always firmly planted in my mind: they all came from the original mold —- which is why I never could see what Tom Terry’s problem was.
What did I care if the corporate ownership papers had changed hands? The only reservation I had was, as Ed mentions, the new plastic now had a shiny sheene, rather than that good, old “flat” finish. But the cost differential was so great that it outweighed that minor problem, so long as the new plastic was soft, pliable, and flexible, as most of the reissue/recasts back then were.
I agree. My main version to “recast” is the bad plastic. There’s nothing like the old Marx matte finish plastic.
I read once that they used reground plastic pop bottles for many of those crappy breakable figures that were made in Mexico, and then put into the party bags. I don’t know for sure if that’s true, but it would explain a lot.
Len,
Yes is true and still does as party favors are piñata fillers=cheap toys..
but Classic Recast had run then in not far BAD produced plastic as special run x us too-just silver colors. So blame there does not go to Mexicans I guess.
Larry Patterson used to make GREAT copies when P & P Products was in business. I think he made a mold from a figure and then made resin copies from that mold. Some of my favorite figures & accessories are from Larry.
I am told one man in Mexico bought out all of the other companies and currently has molds in three different locations. A nephew has been selling stuff to Classic Recasts of San Franciso. As a general rule the owner distrust Americans after some bad dealings and the current wholesale price is high. Evidently he was told he could be sued if he made figures in the old Louis Marx colors so he switched to silver. They will make figures in regrind (yes ex tupperware) plastic or in virgin plastic which is more expensive. Other family relatives (spiderwoman) have gotten a hold of some production and sell on ebay. Galaxy Pilot the man with the Arabs on ebay has been selling recasts + COPIES of Marx figures. They have so many molds they do not know what they have and like Jay Horowitz call everything Marx. It is possible that the Arabs on ebay are recasts/reissues but as Stad has pointed out the pose grouping is incorrect for what had been sold in the Louis Marx Captain Gallant sets. That being said the mold could have been altered years ago due to damage or to make a better assortment. If recast/reissues, these could have been made years ago. If the winner is in this group it would be nice to have a follow up after he inspects them. Evidently there is a lot of old production stuff still in boxes. Spiderwoman was selling some odd color Archer space figures that may have been made in the 1960s after Archer sold their toy molds to concentrate on educational products. I will see if I can find out more.
The way this seller(I had bought and follow from him x years ) it does not represent correct mold type ,his figures are assort taken from a 50 figures mix party bag sold all over Mexico. Nothing new.
This assortment and figures he had are very bad cast compere to some same reissue I have.
He sale French WW2 54 mm complete bad wasted wasted reissue compere with the original first brought by stads,later run in light blue and now in silver,I got samples of all three original base mold reissues and will provide picture much later with dark brown and dark metallic green done and sold as party favors.
In may opinion these are copied molds derivate from original MARX MOLD PIRACY Done by some one in 90’s to distribute X party stores-unrelated complete to real mars mold being used now to reissue in silver and sold under classic r…
The reissues Marx arabs at that price so far are way high and I’m wondering how many more are willing to paid more x reissues on ebay
AMEX figures I carry from Mexico have cast single MARX 70 mm separated in slight 64 mm and Marx Indian climbing palisade 60 mm too, I will provide pictures samples with original. The mold is all new made x the two single poses.
Will take good pictures x relevance’s of above figures w original ,later this weekend to provide here.
Last-spiderwoman is still active and not relation to Mexican family Marx main owner molds.
The WWII French the first time I saw them in Mexico they were in a dark green. When I went down to Mexico and to the Mexican toy fair I bought them in gray which the company which had the mold had produce them. Don Doucette of Heritage toys had them run WWII French in a blue similar to originals
Yes dark forest green in gloss color.
I have those too.
The other metallic green I got are complete waste clone mold.Not same mold and run in 5 poses only.Same in brown chocolate type.
They come in 50 figures bag.
The grey gloss,pale blue and dark forest green are from same marx original mold.
I was told that spiderwoman was the girlfriend of snother nephew of the owner of all the molds.
Kent are you talking about the one from UK ,or the one from DF/MEXICO.?
The one from Mexico I refer to is a he, not a she. I had deal many times with and yes he had carry ex Marx and else plus a bunch bottleneck typical Mexican toys.
He change his name no long ago and reopen a new account after some bad negative on eBay.
Now there had been others under similar name, one from UK other from Germany, another from US ,the name variation is with minor symbol in between or else.
The one from Mexico was first in Spanish as (La mujerarana) ,then ( spider-woman).
So we may be talking about two different or else-maybe!!?
Kent
The first part you have mention before. As I mentioned in previous articles Dinamicos had various Americans try to take advantage of them. I have serious questions on the story about the color restriction. They would be in problems to use the name Marx as it has copyright. Many of the molds from cereal premiums ended up in Mexico .
I heard from Jim Wozniak who has some of the Mexican recasts/reissues that the silver colored figures are injection mold warm up shots before going into virgin plastic production. These still have the cracks and breaks like the fiesta ones. I have some of his recent jungle jim hunters in tan that have cracks. I also have some of his rerun US GIs in dark green. I cannot tell the difference between these and the ones CTS sold years ago. They look and feel identical. I understand from him that spiderwoman is Mexican or from Mexico. I would love to find and get a set of the gunsmoke character figures from Mexico.
I had four Gunsmoke figures from Mexico two Matt’s and two Chesters, two were peach and two were silver. Craig Remington has them now or he did as I sold them to him, I still have the cowboys that came in the same lot, interesting colors pea green , a bright red and some funky brown. The seller claimed they were made by PlastiMarx, but of course I couldn’t prove it, they were in a stiffer plastic than Marx, not that horrible brittle stuff. I think I may have posted pictures of them here about 3 years ago.
There’s a guy at Kane County twice a year that has the resin Gunsmoke character figures, he wants a high price for them though. I believe his name is Bob Overfield. I have his card if anyone wants to contact him.
I am thankful for recast and/or reproductions. I will use my recasts for painting and converting – sparing my beloved original in as close to pristine state as my childhood allowed, though I have done conversions on some of my broken Marx originals and I painted some of my originals bought on ebay for which there are no recasts or reproductions currently available.
I like too use the term recast for figures made from original molds and repros for those made from new molds, though I am just now becoming aware some folks have done that. I kind of wish someone would do that for the Ft Apache “Cavalry” figures and the Marx WW2 Germans. I don’t know there would really be a market for them though as there appear to be plenty of originals still around judging from ebay (sometimes I suspect they may be the same figures just changing hands from auction to auction, but that’s just the way my mind works I guess).
I’ve often thought if I ever get a 3D printer I’d like to make my own slightly modified versions of those figures (among others) to make them fit the more recent figures and maybe a bit more realistic (particularly the Germans, I’d like to make them look more like they’ve been in combat instead of fresh off the parade ground).
I bought a bunch of recasts/reissues from a seller with whom I no longer do business about twenty or so years ago, that were made of a crappy plastic. Many of them came out of the box already broken – it was as bad as the last batch of Imex ACW I bought.
I’ve also gotten some nice high quality recasts; I particularly like what CTS has done with some of the Marx stuff. I don’t know if they’re buying stuff from Mexico or doing their own or doing their own in Mexico but the last bunch of ACW figures I bought looked and felt a lot like the Heritage figures I got in the 70s and I really like how they raised the aim of the Confederate standing firing pose. I think I’ve mentioned elsewhere I’m gradually adding to my collection of their larger wagons – I really need to get some of the renovations done on my house so I can get to the rest of my collection and do an updated inventory to see what I have now.
As for the crappy recasts, I put them in plastic bags and intend one day to dig them out for conversions – that is, if the plastic will bear the handling.
The “Marx” ACW figures you mention are very well made copies of the original Marx figures CTS had made with the reb shooter getting his rifle elevated and the Union group getting three standing shooters instead of one.
Somewhere on here is a story about how Al Straino and I tracked down he import company that brought the original recasts from Mexico. The office was in Westchester, NY and Al and I just took it upon ourselves to go there. We met with the company rep who was very very cordial and could not have been nicer. There really wasn’t much in his office, but I did get a couple of catalogs. I left him my address and telephone number and about 2 weeks later a large box arrived at my home filled to the brim with samples and literature. There are pictures here of some of the ACW packaging and header cards that I sent in.
The first sets of recast were done in a stiffer, but solid plastic. They were in many different colors, very few of which matched the Marx originals. Reds, Yellows, Greens, all sorts of Blues and even black. These were good figures (except for the colors). Parts didn’t break off and the rifles were actually straight. In some ways, there casts were better that the originals because of that. The only problem was that the minimum order was way out of my league.
Eventually, J. McGeogh (I think, I may be wrong here) imported the figures and set the price at 50 cents each.
These were the first recasts and collectors were excited to get them.
But that quickly faded and “correct” colors were demanded.
After that, my memories gets cloudy. I know that Bill Murphy became the point man
and hundreds of old molds were brought back to life.
I also know that in Mexico, the cheaper, soda regrind plastic figures were sold in five and dime stores in bags of 25 or 40 figures. These were brought into the US by several
different people. Paul, I recall that you were one of them.
After that, all different recasts began to appear with various plastics and colors used.
Stone Castle was one of the main sources for these. I don’t know if Stone Castle had their own supply or if they were buying them in bulk, from Murphy and repackaging them. I can say for certain that I bought some metallic blue Mexicans from SC and I can’t tell them apart from the originals. I don’t know what happened, but they disappeared quickly and I’ve never seen them again.
After that, it was hit and miss. I have Rev War figures in the correct colors in the stiffer original recast plastic and in the softer Murphy plastic. The Fort Apache Cavalrymen were issued in Gray and they broke in pieces when you looked at them.
Civil War figures were all over the place in terms of colors and plastic used.
CTS went as far as to make new molds of Marx ACW. They also remade the Andygard
ACW figures even thought they claim that the sculpts are original and that they”were inspired by” and sold to “pay tribute” to the original sculpts.
Yeah, sure.
I brought Mexican Marx reissues in 1980’s after finding them in Tijuana on vacation with family. Did I ever tell the whole story on that? Stone Castle then got the figures in but in the wrong colors. Bill Murphy did get the figures after Dinamicos showed at the New York Toy Fair another story I do not remember if I talked about. CTS tried to deal with Mexico and did not get anywhere. so they bought some Marx cavities from Glencoe Models and had others main in China
I received an answer to my questions from Galaxy.Pilot, the ebay dealer now listing the “Marx 60mm Arab recasts”. Unfortunately, his (or her) answer raises just as many questions as it answers, but here it is:
“NO, THESE ARE NOT FROM THE ORIGINAL MOLDS AND ARE A RECENT RUN. I HAVE OTHER SETS AVAILABLE BUT IN A LIMITED QUANTITY. I JUST FOUND SOME COMPLETE SETS AND OTHER INCOMPLETE. DETAIL AND PLASTIC ARE FANTASTIC.”
Maybe Kent, Admin, or others can now reason out some sense from those comments of what this situation likely is. I’m still apparently the current high bidder, but with two days to go there are already 10 bidders. A couple of weeks ago I was the high bidder right up to 5 seconds before closing time, at which point some unknown collector swooped in and beat me by something like 50 cents. I had already put in what I felt I wanted my maximum bid to be, but at that point I would have paid an extra dollar, if I had time to respond. So I’ve learned not to take anything for granted on ebay, other than you have to stay alert right up to the last second.
The comment is confirming what Erwin and others are saying that the figures are copied. People use tools to be last second bidders.
Don I use a tool in my phone that automatic split seconds by fast connection biding x me.
Once I set it in my phone it does great, but you still have to set it to your maximum desire.
easy 3 steps if not using this way/system
Wait a minute and half before bid end send a bid (not your max),if show you are high bidder will prompt other to bid in last 10 or 12 seconds =equivalent to a click in fast normal internet.
That is you time between second 7 and 4 when you bid again you max and confirm INMEDIATELLY AFTER in second “4”-NO BEFORE PLEASE!!
I guarantee you will win in that way 95%
Few people have internet faster than 2.5 second click twice in phones or at home.
Erwin, thank you for the ebay strategy suggestions. At my age, I don’t know if I’m up to engaging in split-second technology warfare, but I’m making a copy of your suggestion and the next time I’m determined to win on ebay I very well might try it.
But when ebay bidding starts requiring such special gadetry, I may have to return to the old fashioned way of getting my toy soldiers: save my money for when I can attend toy soldier shows.
I do not blame you Don, is a pain to be doing that, just give you some though in case want to, but if I live where you live I will be going Chicago and near area more.
Sound a bit more fun, looks like east coast is too exploited x me in shows now. But in my case is time, always in the rush, too busy.So I depend in technology to do it much better unfortunately.
Detail fantastic?
No what picture show.a lot exess around.
Plastic very good??.no with that gloss …
I do not take those answers honest,neither trustworth??Sorry!? 🙂
I can see clear in picture there is nothing fantastic other that is a surprise they appear as cloned.
My first thought base on rest figures he sale and like I had said the french WW 2 he sold to me long ago with gloss not detail and 5 poses clearly schow these are products take from Marx pirated and made in to new molds.Look at odd 60mm poses ww2 GIs he had with a mix of two different orginal marx mold base and figures look skinny than original.
These are not marx reissues but marx copies figures in to new molds.
The exess show not done as 3D But typical hand pressed mold halve with bad seams.
The two mounted poses are belong to 4 Mexican poses from a 16 poses cowboy set spaniard company call Sotorres.
The set was base in film the 7 magnificent.
But call The seven valient of western.
Those two figures are bottleneg sold in 80s in Mexico and since as pancho villa and zapata in suvenir bags x years.Then by late 90’s to 2000 they not longer sale as that and relate to party favors stores.
I just checked out the other figures he offers on Ebay and have to agree with Erwin that they are copies of Marx figures made in a new mold .
I have a Marx re-issue Untouchables Mol in front of me and I’ve just compared it to the pic of the one he offers, interestingly the new version is bulkier with better definition of the female shape in the arms and legs, more detail on the shoes and a new base. Also in the same lot is a gangster/fed reaching inside his jacket for his gun, but a bad copy and a Football manager with a bulkier torso and shorter legs than the original. So however made the molds they don’t seem very good at it 🙂
I knew and glad you guys saw it, I been seen his figures x years and comparing the disproportion in body between original and or reissues or real Marx mold and his. These and most he sale are piracy ,I will soon post what I had got from him so you guys see it.
Mexican factory x party supply x some reason manage do these with mix figures and made out x piñatas, that why assort miss/mix non related set figures he sale and on.
Look well and get your figures in pictures, pass to your pc and put each picture next to each other with his, will noticed it right away.
In fact the Arab stand=bases bellow do not show Marx mold two entries circle at all in 3 figures.-mean hand pressed figure with low pressaure-dus the factor excess plastic all around. All Marx Arabs as well any figure had the two holes circle from mold entry and exit release pressure from original mold .These he has do not.
To make more clear base in Kent site guide
MARX 60 MM GI’S set PL383,384 AND 385 are three different original mold.
http://www.angelfire.com/biz/toysoldierhq/Marxww.html
this Guy has a set that mix poses from all above sets in one ,clearly show is cloned non Marx set made out of three original mold sets in one ….
I have the original PL 385 and later gloss reissue sold in 90’s that come in exact poses minus one from original PL MARX 385.
Now the set HE-Mexican seller sale is a mix of three and not all poses and he had it from 2010 as been follow him x years, but barely buy few.
Look at set here he sale and compere the poses mix with 3 sets at Kent link page please!!!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MARX-WWII-US-Army-Combat-GIs-Soldiers-60mm-Lot-of-20-Green-Men-Chubby-/121984133544
That means these are non Marx mold but cloned mold from extraction original Marx mold.
Kent sorry x posting your link, hope not a big issue.
no problem, anyone may use my site. That is why I have made it.
I just took a harder look at the Arabs and they don’t show the level of detail I think they should. Pretty sure they are not bad copies which pretty much seems to be something he has done before. If a decent price could be had I would carry them. If panotographed from originals they will be slightly smaller like the figures Ray Plastic had made as target for their guns.
I observe the size ruler he place next to figures and is wrong positioned ,so hard to see the real sise of figures ,unless the person who win the bit if is watching this comments may send us a compere picture with original or else.
The high mark price (which I would never paid x those) indicate a bad signal x seller that will make probably spark a wrong assumption of price per set if he is able to get more x sale..
Any how this seller is not maker, he is just buying from some stores or else who had it and reselling like we all do in some way. So I will wait to see reaction from buyers first if possible.The type plastic could be not of our like (like brittle or too stiff) plus clearly show a lot gloss and excess around(poor molding process) in my opinion hand pressed ,typical used in short production in south and central America indigenous toy figures production.
So again that let us back to mystery of (what happen to real molds!?)
Maybe as years pass we will never know, maybe one day will appear.
The same with FFL, WW2 Germans and WW1 French and Germans 60 mm molds never reissue and western charters plus Sailors 4 poses set .
And then we got the odd lost disappear-rob-else of the temporary found Marx WW2 armor set molds too!!.I mean so much mystery and play around with these molds that is too sad happen.
Question: Could there have been more than 1 set of molds, one set in Hong Kong ,one set in the U.S. ? I know some WOW figures were made in the U.S. ,Hong Kong,Germany, was there was more than 1 set of molds for these figures ?
Mark
I will give a simple answer first, if not enough I will try make a resume of all 60 mm Marx mold as far we know base in Stads,Kent,PFPC, Andrey from Russian and Markus from Germany where will indicate the suppose mold made x each set AS FAR I can make it .
So far because Arabs painted in one color appear showed in this forum few years back only ,it indicate only one Mold (send to HK ) in 60’s was done .
So the same used to unpainted figures for Captain G playset was send there to be done as WOW.(Now I need to see the bottom base of those figures and compere each painted Arab with unpainted to confirm is exact same mold.)
As that is the way most time Marx differentiated one mold from other in bottom circle entrance and exit mold pleasure scape.
Because Arabs were found to be done painted in Marx original boxes as Egyptians I think the FFL are though to be send there as well with same Mold used as unpainted.
Because of value of Arabs and Marx sets I will think if A second mold was in US either would had turn out by now or in Mexico too. Same in WW1 French and Germans ,sailors and WW2 Germans THAT had never appear again.
Marx did often two molds and in some cases 3-(these are very rare and reason why was German factory Heimo) that made extra sets x Marx and kept these mold after. Most repeated 3er mold of same mold such Indian and cowboys from HEIMO -Germany had 1 or 2 extra additional pose complete new on addition to original, so more than 8 poses.
You can often find then in eBay under that brand name and not Marx easy and in good condition as many were done in Rubber, not plastic all painted .
The exclusively figures name and call by Marx as WOW line are those specific made and painted in hard stiff plastic individual boxed in HK Marx factory.
RADO COMPANY ,the mold runner company ,not a toy maker that run the molds for Blue Box too from 1966 till 1987 and (no longer in business and many molds not with then by now) Run in also in 90’s for a British dealers many ex -WOW-Marx molds in unpainted sets he found there. But never Arabs or FFL in 60 mm; wile the 30 mm Arabs and FFL were run and still around but not longer from warehouses. RADO.
Many dealers such ATS from PA carry and still have some 60mm and 30 mm sets in stock.
The Marx 60mm French Foreign Legion were run in the hard plastic and painted Warriors of the World and samples were sent Germany Toy Fair at Nurnberg. Nick Argento of Glencoe claimed that the Marx French foreign Legion mold was in Florida but gone before he could buy it. The 30mm mold of the French Foreign Legion is in China and has been sold on blister card in Toy R US
Thanks x adf up in FFL admin.Was not aware of those.
Yes I saw the FFL.Made in china.I assume after RADO liquidate all end up there spread in all direction.Neither I had saw any marx when travel there other than some old 90 stocks of same here.
Any how any HK factory since 1996 printed as made in China ,so that was all.
Too sad as all now there is pretty much lost.
Admin.
So aperantly that person claim the one mold
Sent to HK was back in US and then off again to who knows where?
That sound off …
So maybe a second mold?
Or not real happen.
My thoughts
I just want to put Glencoe story out as it might have been mention to other people. I do not say it is true or false as I do not have further information to confirm it or not.
I know you pass it admin and appreciate it
, interesting any how !!
More interesting is the Germany Toy Fair at Nurnberg. Do you know the year or around it was?
Thanks for the info Erwin !
With 21 hours to go, my $41.00 bid has been surpassed, and the high bid is now $48.00. With a $13.00 shipping charge, the total price (if everything ended right now) would be $61.00. That basically equates to more than $5.00 per figure, when you count the camel.
But with 16 separate bids so far, I expect things to heat up even further as the bidding deadline approaches. Who knows where the final price will end up.
This might be a good one to try out the last-minute bidding strategy Erwin suggested. Unfortunately, I can see my own idea of what is a “reasonable price” for this set will likely be eclipsed. But the more I think through how Erwin suggests we approach bidding in the last couple of minutes, the more I think it will work. I know I’ll be trying it out at some point, but likely not on this one.
Don.I sugest not go crazy.In my opinion that price as u well said counting the shipping is already in my opinion over the real price these copied cloned figures.
I notice between two sets,there 16 bidders.
Changes are they end at same price or above original figures set.Not way those figures should be any were more than 5.00 per figure.
Vintage are from 18 to 35 max
If you go a show I bet u can buy a hold set poses for a good deal.If not check stads as I often had bought from him good poses x a very fair price.He find then few times and list then but go fast.
I bet most bidding much higer think these are only one.
This seller have more and will list then.
Now these high bid will problaby too give him a false imagination high price x next listing.
So lets hope he not get greedy.
And always you have to get your own max price set, before decide go for last minute bid plus fast internet of course.
Best and hope u get next..
You have to realize when to quit as Erwin stated these are not one of kind figures. I am sure we will see more pop up
I have cards with the 30 mm FFL, but I do not recall Arabs. Were Arabs included?
Bill, if you are talking about the cards with small FFL clones that were sold in ToysRUs – I never saw small Arabs. The cards I bought there had little blisters of FFL mixed in with little blisters of green roughly 20mm Airfix clones – the usual mix of US Marines and British paratroopers. I suspect that the Chinese outfit that marketed these to box stores etc. didn’t even see them as FFL per se – just little soldiers to mix in with the usual green guys as opponents. A FFL vs. Arab card would have been fantastic if the shrunken Arabs were available to the manufacturer – but I suspect that they would not have seen such a specialized historical set as very marketable. It would have been nice to see all the small pantographed Marx figures available in inexpensive sets like these. For whatever it is worth, I have not seen any sets of 20mm Chinese stuff in the stores lately – they used to be all over in dollar stores and in sets of birthday party favors.
The cards only had the Foreign Legion figures. I am sure they could of got the Arabs but the Foreign Legion for the enemy
By luck I was able to find an unopened example of the cards of small FFL I bought at ToysRUs. It is labeled “Combat Set” and has some Vietnam War looking GIs and an Abrams tank as the illustration. It was marketed by Manley Toys – item No. 50031 and dated 1999. It has six small blisters on the card – three with the small greyish FFL and three with the green 20 mm Airfix clones, a mix of Marines and British WWII paras. To drive home that the Chinese factory had no concerns about the nationality of these figures, each blister contains a small flag – US, UK, Japan, France, Germany, and a flag I can’t immediately identify – three horizontal stripes, white on the top, then blue, then red. I think I paid about a dollar for these. I’d love to see this stuff re-appear.
No the Arabs were not included only ATS and Marksman of the UK
The “Marx 60mm Arab recasts” (from Mexico) just went for $81.99 + $12.99 shipping. With something like 36 bids, the winning bid was put in by bidder “1…x”, who had no previous bids showing.
I put in a maximum bid of 74.99. And there seemed to be 3 others bidding at the end. I guess we’ll never know what the maximum bid put in by the ultimate winner was —- how much he was actually willing to pay.
Erwin, I can see the absolute logic of your last minute bidding system, and am planning on using it again in the future. I’m convinced the only reason I didn’t win this time was simply that someone was willing to go to a higher maximum than I was.
Don ,like I said ,put a price top limit you think you will paid, but think how many with that price as of now original Arabs in this case you can buy.
Those bidding high and responding to Ed bellow comment too I think are either obsessives bidders(there plenty) that think bid is a win or a loose game .
Few others are with a lot money and want spend too much.
Also before I bid I check seller score. I know some times scores are not fear, but any ebay seller/buyer with score under 97.5% or it should be careful to buy/sale from/to. It is a risk.
If an item is x me I set my bid max ,if I see they pass it ,good x them. I’m not getting insane x it.
Literally at the price already those paying or willing to paid I’m laughing
I think they just doing a race match, not logic x any Marx reissues or better cloned as these are when you can get vintage x very good deal in short time .AND Marx Arabs vintage are abundant, every week I see few lots /else listed on eBay, some go nuts, others very good deal. I’m not even checking the many shows that I bet are there too.
People are notorious for paying high prices on E-Bay, most of the time higher than I would even think of going. Since we sell a lot on E-Bay, thank God. I just can’t win any bids, like ever.
I agree that if the item is good and rare it will go for a High price. I can not win a good lot in an auction.
They end from 7.80 to 8.90 per figure as they got few accessories mix and a camel.
Why are people paying so much for recasts??
Have no idea? There are a number of reason first to have them, still cheaper than originals, don’t care about cost just want them, etc. It is just one more example in this crazy world
To think, he may have listed them for $24.99 Buy It Now!!
$24.99 is actually what I thought would be a reasonable retail price.
I think he knows what marx arabs are.
I mean, now he knows.Sorry
No one has seen before so they think it’s a once in a lifetime thing, so they have to have them damn the torpedos. If sets appear on E-Bay regularly they’ll end up kicking themselves. Got to be the first kid on the block to have them.
I remember 10 or 15 years ago on eBay, a guy listed a then current production $12.99 Reamsa Western Town Folks 8 figure set as “Unknown, Rare (blah, blah, blah) Figures”. He split the figures into two auctions & the bids got up over $200 each auction. Back then, you could contact eBay members & people e-mailed the high bidders to wise them up & they reneged on the bids. The seller cursed people out, threatened people, etc,. etc. who informed the bidders of what he was doing. They even talked about it in Playset Magazine. The same seller used to sell $5 Dulcop recast bartenders as “rare one of a kind mystery” figures & people would bid them up to $40 – $50, if not more. He seemed to have the same “one of a kind” figure on every two weeks & people kept up with the crazy bids. This same guy was always doing these “mystery” figure listings on readily available recasts & making big bucks. Heck of a “marketer”. Haven’t seen him around for years. Recent phenomena that surprises me are the prices of Barzso figures & sets for such great inflation over original cost. But then again – Johnny Ringo for $1600????????
I just list other day in a link a guy selling dollar tree store 4″ cloned varied poses of tim mee viet nam figures as (rare vintage figures) x $27.99 or more starting price.
Incredible there those who paid x them, so definitely out there there a lot of collectors that do not have a clue in what is what and who made what. I bet they do not even know about toy soldiers shows and magazines at all!!
Crazy world out there.
About Barzso is diferent in my opinion.
I also notice the Barzso resin figures going x crazy price more than actual Conte not longer done. But I think it is because Barzso figures made in resin were not mass injected figures as Conte and others and it create the logic of been hard to get every year as limited numbers sets done, versus 5 -6 000 sets run per shot of Conte sets.
The same in playset that were much less done than Conte.
So Barzso resin will continue to increase and been more scares every time
Do some Ebay sellers use their friends as ‘shills’, to run the bids up? Or do they use alternate Ebay identities to run the bids up on them selves? Are there any protections built into Ebay to prevent this kind of manipulation? Just wondering.
The ebay is tricky.Ebay x years had try to eliminate these scam used by some sellers.
But is hard to do.
By own experience it is almost impossible x one person to use two differnt account constantly to do this as ebay monitor it automatic and after 3 or more times done may cancel both or one account.
In the other hand.Yes two or more friends could partner to send bids in your listing and it is used.But to what level it is used is hard to estimate as will involved profits x those helping .so they had to share the end sale price.
In this particular case as ebay won’t let you x privacy see who is the others bidders unless u are seller.You can still see from what country are.
Before arabs marx bid ended I check countries bidders,included 5 from US,one from UK,two from Germany,one from.Italy and one from Canada
I doubt this seller will have so many connections to do this.
This was a typical bid and honestly I’m happy for seller as he made the money.
I think even if I agree went crazy up ,it is still a rare all new not see set in 50 years and not even marx mold with actually a better set up poses than originals.
Don’t many collectors buy russian 6 figures set x 50.00+ shipping??
Or Stengels figures x 4/6 per figures??
Engineer Batsevich x $4.90 per figure approx?
So $7 to 8 in caramel and less x white arabs was not that bad after all I guess!!! 🙂 🙂
Any how I would not had paid more than 5.50 per figure as that is my top prize consiseration in this case.Any how I did not bid at all.:-) 🙂
But also because I like see sellers sale their items good.Good x him.
TD
The best defense on bidding is discipline. You set a stop goal on a item and stick to it. Realize you will not win them all.
Ebay has protection when u open an account.
You need to type your ID and match it against u own adresss and phone.
Paypal same.
So u will able to use one account with one ID only per person.You can not ouse same ID in others name
They match u phone with sending a text or call to you and seen to who it is register after verifaction of number with cell or cc telephone company that provide u services
Yes, I’m quite sure that some people use their buddies to bid up an item for them. I dont know how often it has happened or how widespread, but I know for a fact it has happened. I will not reveal how I know. If there is a way to cheat, people will discover the method.
Of course, using shills at any auction — ebay or the traditional kind — has long been a practice that people have to be aware of. Like Erwin said, it’s hard to prove or to spot. And as Admin said, the only sure protection is to set your limit in advance so as not to get carried away. But the presence of shills can be a danger at a traditional auction, probably even more easily than on an ebay auction.
In the case of these Arab recasts, I wanted them —- at least up to about $75.00. That price will strike many as absurd, but so do all the other prices people pay for vintage toy soldiers these days. If the general public could see what Rick Eber asks for his boxed Marx playsets, it would be horrified at what “gullible fools” toy soldier collectors can be who actually pay prices like that. And the same goes for all the other vintage plastic that’s offered for sale to collectors. For almost any item, someone will think it’s “crazy” that someone would give good money for such worthless (to them) “junk”.
Basically, it’s all up to what a particular individual wants, and how much money he can afford for such discretionary spending. An auction seems about as fair a method as any for figuring out what an item’s real ‘value’ is. As always, “value” is whatever somebody will pay for it at some point in time.
Yesterday, to at least one individual, the “value” of that set of brown 60mm Marx Arab recasts was about $95.00, postage paid.
It s how much someone wants to pay for an item. For me I usually will not spend more than $20.00 on one figure. Since I got my number one want the Speedwell armored car on fire so many years ago. I am really not looking for anything. It is now what I see at a show and if the price is right I buy it.
I see now Don thinking on Marx Arabs cloned from Mexico.
Yes they could be see too as vintage in value and still $7.50, his price willing aprox per figure counting camel and shipping would be much less than real original at $15-25 I had got them most.
And yes as admin said discipline is best and set your price mind.
Regarding cheating at face to face bid auction are a lot too.
EBay required a lot rules and I had report delinquent active and they had cancel members because my reports.
I do list in eBay but most -98% are (buy now ) with offer option.
I do it to avoid issues on bidding as those cases. I set my minimum sale offer so automatic sale or refuse according to buyers offers. I list rules that said (do not contact me x separated items/else from lot or other offer other than eBay set offer) -otherwise will be ignore. If some one does I block the person doing so as either is not trusted or not care about rules.
Still I offer full returns /refunds in complete lot sold, not partial and work things with buyers if issues.
I offer first class over priority all time except when lots pass 13oz national or 4 pounds international.
In the past I had two account, one open first and close ,then open new one(actual).Not two at same time.
I do sale more from my store generally than eBay store.
Buying: I’m very cheap and once see they pass my max set price I let go, half my win are international and won at international not eBay blogs bid places site.
So again look good at member feedback/score before buy or even sale. Read the type neutral and negative feedback he/she has and take your conclusion and decide to bid/buy or not. There always a risk as there risk some one ahead you buy the toys you want at a show before you spot it.
A few months ago, I bid on an item on e-bay. For a while, I was the only bidder. Then a few others bid until I was outbid on my set amount. A few days later, the same item came up for bid again, not one like it, but the same item. It was won again by someone, and then, a week later, here it came for bids again. Seemed fishy to me, but I have seen this happen several times with different items and different sellers. It might have been a buyer not paying, or it could be a seller working with someone else to get more money. We may never know.
Bobby G. Moore
yes there are people who like to play these games eventually they get caught.
Yes they could be either way, but eBay monitor it, I had see this and see the players got cancel x good.
I had also list on bid (not buy now) same issue as either bidder winner do not paid after few days and send several email, so I relist or offer to bidder before winner as I had that option of sold items.
Also you got “sellers vultures” I call them, they observe eBay sales and list immediately same or similar items x sale as well base on other sellers.
In your case (buyers or bidder)you will be able to see as bidder where (state and city) is the seller from .
If similar item appear more than once you can compere and see if from same place -then assume is same seller. If not most logic is not same.
Ironical enough about a day before the Marx Arabs from Mexico bid end 17 different MARX vintage Arabs had pup up on eBay and I bet more coming. It happen too because either the sellers observing it or else. Funny that some odd bright red not often seen Arabs appear more now listed.
Also camels x sale that barely sale separated .
If it was something I was really into and it wasn’t all that common, I might let myself get sucked into a bidding war. Right now, the only thing I’d shell out for are certain odd color Timmee Russians in certain poses, because that has been my ‘quest’ since about 1997. I need 2 poses in that translucent lime green and 11 poses in the khaki-tan, which I’ll never complete. I know of one other tan figure and he won’t sell.
You talking about “copies” or else Greg!?
I made a lot of copies. I need 2 more original lime poses and the tan ones are believed to be test shots. I only know of 2 and I have one.
I hate the guys that put out a pile of figures and you can see part of , but not all of a character figure, you then take chance and when you get the lot you find the part of the character figure you couldn’t see was the broken part. You can’t prove it of course but you know he did that on purpose, what can you do what you see is what you get. Of course never bidding on an item from that seller is my usual response. I know bidding on a pile of figures you can’t completly see is a risk, but that’s what makes it fun and some guy deliberatly salting the pile isn’t cool.
I ask for additional pics if that’s the case. I did that with the lot I got from Bob Wilson. Those Timmee wagon train guys were exactly what I needed and easily repairable. The other ‘saves’ were just bonuses.
I got three lime green guys all carrying the machine gun on their shoulder, except I may have gotten them from you.
I think you might have. I had a lot of that pose in lime. I’ve got absurd amounts of them in olive, forest green and red supplemented with resin copies I made. I only want 1 of each in lime and tan.
I’m glad u got a “huge lot deal” of those Russian. I ended reselling half and recoup plus what I spend, kept over 40 x myself. The quality in most was very close, with few with bubble resin effect of course BUT SO WHAT!!A nice add to my originals.
Wonder WHY NOT MAKE MORE OFF!!?? and same could be done with Japanese Lido too I think as pretty much 2D molded.
I think was from Mike if I’m not mistaken who I get the buy from.
I still have some of the ones Greg made. Did sell 10 at Lafayette.
I don’t have the molds anymore. I had made 8 poses and a Brit named Lee Turner had made the other 4 and we sort of put out efforts together. When I was heading back to Iraq for another year of rest and recreation, I sent him the molds to continue casting all poses. Well….he died. He had cancer and took some sort of experimental medication and it dropped him. I didn’t dare bother his widow with anything so trivial