We received the following update from Jim McGough of CTS on their Korean War Chinese and what else is planned.
Hi Paul
It’s been a while since I’ve seen you and Laurie, hope you are both well. Just wanted to let you know that we (CTS) have sets of North Koreans, South Korean, U.S. Marines and assorted heavy weapons with crews planed in various stages of development. GI’s, other U.N. participants and Vehicles are also in discussion.
We appreciate being able to see the collectors feedback on your open blog.
Regards
Jim McGough, Dave Payne and Tim McGough
I think they look great, if I did WWII, I’d buy them for sure. I may buy them anyway.
I have been putting together Korean War dioramas with whats applicable from wwII (TSSD marines, FOV Pershing&T-34/76, Figarti NK and marines), and I am happy to see someone treating the subject with accurate figures. I ordered a set of the new Chinese infantry the moment I received the notice from CTS that they were available. Looking forward to Marines, hopefully with winter gear and parkas!
Mike
I am sure other people are looking forward these figures too.
Mike –
That’s a T-34/85 and that’s the one you want for Korean War scenarios.
This makes the already good news of a great set even better to know CTS has plans to follow through with a complete series. May Korea no longer be the “Forgotten War” – at least as far as toy soldiers are concerned. Thanks to CTS.
Great news. Wonder what kind of terrain or buildings will be developed for the Playsets? No word on the Marines being Winter or regular? Too bad 21st Century or FOV didn’t make a F-86 Sabre and MIG in 1/32.
That is super news. Hope that the North Koreans will be uniformed and equipted like the Chinese so you can use them togather. I have always thought that the company that does the Korean War in plastic and goes all out and does it right will hit a gold mine. Any news on release dates?
Bobby G. Moore
Already pre ordered my CTS Chinese, but with one stipulation. They are the proper size to go with Conte & TSSD. CTS last set of Germans were perfect but I look back on there Civil War a few years ago they were tiny, there GI,s were a bit larger, but still undersized. Hope this works out as I,m rally looking forward to these.
Gary
The CTS figures are the perfect size. Other makers are too large.
It seems to me that the Marx U.S. Army tanks which appeared in the Marx Battleground and Combat sets were based on the Pershing Tank, which as previously noted only appeared in small numbers very late in WWII. Does anyone know if that is true —- that the Marx U.S. Tanks were based on Pershings? Is the Auburn rubber U.S. tank also based on a Pershing?
If true, that would mean that the Marx tanks fit in perfectly in a Korean War setting, since the Pershings were in fact the main U.S. battle tank in the Korean War. Of course, it’s still smaller than the 1/32 scale soldiers it would be used with, but that was true of all the Marx WWII playsets, as well.
Yes, both the #41 and #51 Marx US tanks plus aurburn are base on Pershing(m26) tank with minor modification and short cannon. Also ANZIO invader(BY IDEAL)-much larger size two vehicles M53 and M26 Pershing in the shooting and not shooting version. What happen is only Marx 51 tank is the closes to 1:32 scale you can get as other Marx and aurburn tank are too small or in case ideal/Marx M26 shooting verssion too large that only match with 70 mm scale ideal or auburn figures(Korean war GI’s)
IDEAL also made a crude m46(Patton ) tank used in the KOREAN conflict too, it s still sold recast/reissue by few dealers. This model is more 1:35 scale but the closes you can get of a very rare tank that give transition to much modern and more used tank later.
I notice on the Classic Toy Soldier (CTS) website, it is already marketing it’s Soviet long-barreled T-34 tank as “good for the Korean War”, and it’s Sherman Tank as “good for the early stages of the Korean War”. CTS is also marketing it’s Marx WWII U.S. Infantry repros. as “good for the Korean War”. Similarly, TSSD, after announcing the new CTS Chinese figures, now labels both it’s U.S. Marines and it’s U.S. Army Fire Support figures (in their heavy winter coats) as “suitable for Korean War”.
I don’t mind any of this, and there’s nothing wrong with it. Getting double-duty out of figures to allow them to be used in multi-different playsets is in the best tradition of Marx. I think CTS has now given us, however, the one essential missing ingredient of the Korean War —- 54mm scale Chinese Communists.
I notice on the CTS website the WWII 105mm howitzer is now identified as “Korean War Allied Forces Artillery”
The other essential we need is Marines/GI’s in Winter Parka’s.
Maybe you guys know but when I google images of US Korean War Winter I only see a few soldiers in WW2 style overcoats. We’re these only worn in the 1st year of the conflict?
Try “us korean war winter troops photos”, and quite a few photos of U.S. troops in winter and cold weather coats and jackets come up.
OK ,the M4 (CTS) Sherman is not at all the late period ww2 M4 tank, neither that version was used in Korea as was discontinued in production in early 1944 and those remaining were rearmed and converted before 1947 .Only M4 LATE period with large 76 mm canon were issue and used to Korea together with M26(pershing),and Patton m46(one done by ideal) plus few m10 and m18.Been m36 the most tank killer delivery to marine corps from 1951 to Japan first, then to Korea .
The CTS t/34/85 was used and is “correct” to be label as being part of NKA or Chinese PLA forces.
About winter gear/coats it differ a lot from ww2 long coat and parkas used by US and UNO /SK forces too. So unless you don’t mind that you can use then.
Summer later US infantry done by TSSD/CONTE and even matchbox could be used .The more KOREAN WAR type uniform depicted in early soldiers were those of IDEAL and Aurburn,being Aurbrun the only more accurate and few Marx too.
The Korean War was the first clash between Western and Communist forces after World War II. While tanks played a part in most important Korean War battles, supporting the infantry, there were no major tank battles during the war. The mountains and forests that covered Korea made large tank battles impossible. Most of the tanks used during the Korean War were developed and used during World War II. The North Korean tank force consisted of Soviet T-34/76 and T-34/85 medium tanks. Although these World War II tanks were old, they still were very effective. When the North Koreans invaded South Korea in June 1950, using T-34s, the South Koreans had no tanks of their own. The best anti-tank weapon that the South Koreans had was the American M9 anti-tank rocket launcher, also known as the bazooka. It was not powerful enough to do any damage to a T-34. To damage a T-34, a South Korean soldier would have to get close to the tank with a satchel charge or a grenade. This was, obviously, extremely dangerous. Soon after the invasion of South Korea, the United Nations voted to support the South Koreans. Many nations began sending troops and weapons to South Korea. The first tanks to be used by UN forces in South Korea were American M24 Chaffee light tanks, which were also used during the Second World War. They were sent to South Korea from Japanese army bases. While the Chaffee was useful for infantry support, it could not stand up to a T-34. Later on, more UN tanks arrived. These included: From America M4 Sherman medium tank -later models with long HV 76 mm cannon used in World War II, M26 Pershing heavy tank – used in World War II ,M10,M18 AND M36 gun motor carriage – used in World War II .M46 Patton medium tank – entered service in 1949 M41 Walker Bulldog light tank – entered service in 1951, also used in Vietnam From Great Britain Firefly – British version of the American M4 Sherman(long barrel), used in World War II A22 Infantry Tank Mark IV Churchill – used in World War II A27M Cruiser Tank Mark VIII Cromwell – used in World War II A41 Centurion Mark 13 main battle tank – entered service in 1945.Also the m53 self-propelled cannon and later used in Vietnam The M46 Patton medium tank is the only tank that saw combat in the Korean War and no other wars.
So here are the MOST/MORE recommended choices we have in my opinion so far.
In economic way but most not is scale or too much detail.
From CTS.BRAND AND OTHER DEALERS/BRANDS
-CTS RUSSIAN T34/85
-CTS CHURCHILL TANK
-CTS US M3 HALFTRACK
-AIRFIX SHERMAN TANK
-AIRFIX DAIMLER SCOUT CAR
-BMC AMTRACK
-MPC TRACK VEHICLES(NOT VERY REALISTIC),ONLY ONE LOOK LIKE A FIELD TRACTOR
-IDEAL RECAST PATTON M46 TANK
-MPC DUCK
-MARX AND CTS FIELD CANNON
From vintage selection.
MARX 41 AND 51 TANKS RESEEMBLING M26 PERSHING
AURBURN SMALL TANK
TIM MEE Staghound ARMORED CAR
IDEAL/MARX US HALDTRACKS FROM TRAINING CENTER AND BATTLEGROUND(ONCE AGAIN) scale are odd but is up to collector to the choosing.
AIRFIX A27F CROMWELL TANK
AIRFIX BEFORD TRUCK
AIRFIX BRITISH CANNON.
IDEAL/MARX LARGE DUCKS
IDEAL LARGE SIZE ANZIO INVADER M26 AND M53.ALSO DONE IN A DIFFERENT VARIATION BY MARX/MPC/PAYTON.AND NOW REISSUE/CLONED AND SOLD BY (selltoy).Under AMEX BRAND.(IN BOTH THE CANNON IS DONE A BIT THICK BUT VEHICLE IS VERY REALISTC CLOSE AND TRUE 1:32 SCALE.
AIRFIX AND MPC WEAPON ACCESORIES FROM TRAINING CENTER AND OTHER SETS
More expensive and detailed.
21 AND FORCES OF VALOR ARMOR/VEHICLES SUCH AS
CHAFFE LIGHT TANK
US HALFTRACK
LONG/SHORT TOM CANNON
SEXTON HOTWITZER
FORD JEEP
WEELY JEEP
US TRUCK
M4/A3 SHERMAN
T/34/85
OTHERS.
British Saladin (FV601) six-wheeled armored car.(DONE BY DINKY AND OTHERS IN 1.45 SCALE BUT BY HONK KONG COMPANY IN TRUE 1:32 SCALE ,ALSO A MARX BATTERY VERSSION WAS DONE IN 1:30 SCALE TOO.
AND FEW OTHERS I MAY MISS.
I think base in the fact the few armor versus armor encounter were in Korean war and tanks were more used as artillery infantry support. There is plenty choices so far.
If ever Vietnam soldiers are made then it will be the moment that we will need more armor/vehicles as few had ever been done in non kit models and few of those used in Korea war were ever or still used by then.
I remember as a kid hearing a couple Korean War vets talking about going up against some US M4 Shermans with Red Stars painted on them; leftovers from WW2 Lend-Lease to the Soviets (maybe Chinese, but I’ve never heard or read of us sending tanks to either Mao or Chiang during the war). Always found that interesting, if sadly ironic.
Wayne. Yes, Sherman M4/2 AND 3 type M3 Lee and Stuart tanks were send from august 1943 till December 1946 to nationalist armies Chiang , not Mao; Used in the BURMA CAMAPING AGAIST Japanese by Chinese 200 division.Then most taken over by Communist and used when the red start their 1948/49 offensive and victories. Over 12 are in display at museum in China now .Because lack or repair parts by 1949 most were not in use and discontinued.China start receiving first T/34/76 ,later T34/85 from Soviets. During Korea war Soviets send more armor to China in order to supply Korean Red forces too, China kept most and send their old stock to Korean as they know tank were of few use in the stalemate battles of mountains and by 1954 China not longer want to keep fighting for Korea.
More about general information could be found in this link.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanks_in_China
I will assume those veteran are mentioning are Sherman m4/3 later models taken over by Chinese in the battle of Battle of Unsan on October 1950 when the 1st US cavalry division was overrun and destroyed by massive first Chinese offensive. The 1st ROK(south Korean division ) and US 6TH BATTALION used all Sherman tanks to support and help the 1st US.
During the retreat all tanks and armor vehicles were taken over by Chinese. Many were repair and half were even intact as not time to destroy then was given because most were in depot or resting areas These were in fact the first 17 US Sherman to be reused by Chinese and Korean during war, more were taken over from October to December 15 when all American/ROK and ONU forces had retreat. According to RED Korean sources the KOREAN AND CHINESE used 122 SHERMANS,11 m36 during the war .12 were active in 1954 with Korean commies.
the only type of Sherman tank used and delivery to Korea was the (M4A3E8 Easy Eight )
Thanks for some great info. I remember the Victor Mature movie, but forgot the name of it. As far as the 1st Cavalry Division’s retreat in Korea, the saying used to go about the patch, “the horse that was never ridden, the river (or line) that was never crossed, and the yellow’s the reason why.” They lost their colors in Korea. But I don’t know how many units could have held against what they faced under the circumstances and the Cav definitely earned them back and made up for it in Nam and ever since.
I have a nephew in the 1st Cav now. Just got back from the sandbox.
If you want to see Commie Shermans check out a Victor Mature flic called “The Glory Brigade” at least I think that’s the flic.Came out in early 50’s Black&White about a mixed patrol of Greek and US soldiers in Korea.
I think 21st Century did a Walker Bulldog. Has the Marx 51 Tank ever been recast? Or is the mold missing?
I had never see/heard of the Marx 51 tank recast,will love it as it was the only close 1:32 scale simple plastic tank ever made by Marx with historical accuracy of the M26 pershing tank.
The Marx “51” would need a serious up gunning,even back in the day I wondered why it was given such a small barrel,I used to cut it off and drill a hole and stick a Lollypop stick in to give it a serious cannon.I only had 2 and they were lost in the Great Firecracker Wars.I since picked up a few on Ebay but at the price I paid I left them alone,LOL.
Another question is there a 1/32 scal F-86 Sabre out there.
As far I know ,only F-86 large I had seen is 1:48 scale, not 1:32.But I may be wrong.
yes, the same in the 41 model, but changing the barrel is not a big issue, the problem as you mentioned, the price on those 51 Marx tank are a pain.I try few times and no way, they go over 100.00 easy
One just sold on Ebay tonite(331500312842) for $79US!!
that is a low price!!;you could had win it!!
Any ways forces of valor is more accurate and run about that price.In my opinion I value high price vintage when nostalgic ,in this case that tank is not for me ,neither the m26 was that important in ww2 or Korea; more Sherman and m46 plus chaffee were used .So I wont bid in any of those …
I picked up 9 of the Marx 51 tanks for fairly cheap from various sources. I was patient and don’t think I ever paid over $40 for one. I use them as all sorts of tanks, depending on what I’m doing at the time. I’m ‘over’ the hyper-accuracy thing, I just enjoy my toys. They’ve been used as KV-1’s, IS-2’s, M-26, M-46, and more that I just don’t recall. The Marx 41 gets used as T-26’s, BT-7’s, Valentines, Matildas, Ha-go, etc.
I know what the real ones look like, but I also realize I’d need another house just for my toys if I had EVERY model of tank I wanted, every perfectly correct vehicle, soldiers in precise time period uniforms for EVERY conflict. I’m not saying it’s wrong if somebody wants to go that route, but I really enjoy getting more use out of my ‘old friends’ and fuss less about the pocket arrangement on the uniform of an Airfix, or Marx, or whatever, soldier.
For what my opinion is worth, I believe CTS Puts out some pretty detailed figures, I really like the German WWII wounded set that came out in 2012. I was up to see Jim a few weeks ago and got to see the Korean War Prototypes in person. GREAT JOB.
I agree. CTS seems to think it out better than most. They find a niche, decide if it is potentially profitable and get to it. Always finding something that hasn’t been done. The German WWII wounded sat is a great example. The stretcher team runs circles around the Timpo one, which is tough to find and a bit pricey. There’s NEW stuff there. I’d not seen a German medic in plastic anywhere. Sadly, they are forced into working within a narrow band of what most collectors want, for WWII that’s the last 11 months of the war in Europe (D-Day to VE Day). It shied them off from doing more stuff like the Italians, which added the much needed Breda light MG to the Airfix and CTS mix that is about the only good choices out there. I was hoping for the M-13/40 tank to be done, but I doubt we’ll ever see it from CTS if it wasn’t done as a follow-up to the Italians. Just to add: I’m aware of the HaT Italians and they are in separate ‘units’ for me because one is a Paratrooper unit in desert uniform and the other is in Desert uniform and appears to be Bersaglieri.
Yes CTS is one the few releasing more logic set/versus profit demand sale. Not like other doing over done sets from same time. They latest WW2 SETS are way above in detail poses compare to first early japs and Germans. That any ways come after so many years of any one dare to produce nothing. They dare to do Italians and sold well as by then only airfix had done and the rare Atlantic vintage. Later hat/waterloo sets come out.Like many had say WW2 WAS A WORLD WAR,.
Most later produed just dpo either latyer period geramn American and japs and barely Russian. British/COMW are needed. So French 1940,polands1939,Rumanian(as those Italian CTS used as then are not correct).
Yes polish and French were defeated,SO WHAT!!.They fought and are part of history too; so were early Russian, British and American defeated too. What about early Americans for 1941/1942 campaigns with British pot helmet and different uniform weapons!?.
About early germans so far Airfix,Matchbox,Esci ,Atlantic,Dulcop and Britain cover that. Japanese did not change so much so any figures could be used from 1938 till war end.
Last I will like to add that from beginning CTS playset offered the best selection and historical accurate combined sets in market versus price profit using their own products with others. Not like others offering a mix of either recast or wrong named and historical lot figures in the playsets.
Need a CTS Robert Taylor “Bataan” figure set(Brit Helmets,Springfields)